So I have been unable to get any of my own posts up this week. The good news is that our business is extremely busy and there are so many wonderful projects going on that I am literally running from one project to another.
That coupled with school, coupled with family has meant that my blogging has suffered. I have still had the privilege of being involved with a number of really good and interesting discussion lately on various topics. One of them has been on this blog post.
I confess I don't know much about the author, but she suggests that divorce is inherently selfish. The comments are really interesting. Her reasons for her position are really interesting to me as well. Some of her provocative statements in the post are the following:
I see divorce in every story. For example, as soon as I heard about the school shootings in Chardon, OH, I got stuck on the fact that the kid’s parents had just gotten a divorce and left him with his grandparents. I blame the parents.
I’ve heard those things so many times. From parents who are getting a divorce who are full of shit
This one is really provocative
Divorce is for people who can’t think ahead enough to realize that the cost to the kids is so high that it’s not worth the benefits the parents get.
Because divorce is the ultimate example of just running away. And, while your kids probably will not pull out a gun in the school cafeteria, long-term sadness and a lingering inability to connect to other people is an irrefutable result of divorce. It’s something that you can prevent.
I interact with people in various stages of a relationship with divorce. Some are headed that way. Some are coming back from it. Some are pondering it. Some have lived through it. Whenever the topic comes up, the discussion is usually pretty intense. You can read her whole post by going here.
But then I'd love to hear your thoughts. What do you think about what she is writing? I saw this on a Facebook page and the back and forth was amazing.
P.S. If you do comment there, please don't attack her personally. Feel free to agree or disagree with her position but leave the person out of it.
Some people think that divorce are always selfish and I somewhat agree there. Reasons such as “Irreconcilable Differences” are what peeves me most. Those I think are selfish reasons.
The title of your post is what drew me to read on. This is actually the second time I have attempted to make a comment on such a post and hope this post will not bring me the pat answers everyone is ready to give which lead to a demoralizing outcome.
Having said that I proceed with great caution and humility. I was married for 32 years and for the last 18 -20 years lived in a world where it was the norm to burry your questions / concerns and hurts, so as not to go through the pain of facing what was wrong. I would do everything possible to try and explain my feelings in an attempt to stop putting on the “sunday morning everything is wonderful” face for every church event we attended.
I wanted more from my life and the marriage but if you looked around it would appear as if we had a good marriage, after all it had years accumlated which would relate to “a good marriage” and please don’t take my statements as I did everything correct because as it takes two to make a good marriage it takes the same two to destroy that marriage. After the split because of an affair and other underlying issues such as porn and feelings of incompleteness along with insecurities the councilor told us we did not have a marriage. Our relationship resembled one where two people owned a business. I for one did not want a business relationship I wanted a Marriage, one that would resemble Christ love for His church.
I am almost 5 years from the split and have been re-married for two years. We have attended several churches (denomination will remain anonymous) with the same underlying acceptance that divorce is clearly rated much higher than other sins.
Anyway that is the past. Today God has blessed us with an awesome marriage and relationship. We both realize that there was no magical ferry dust sprinkled on us during our vows and at this point in our lives we have discovered that having a strong and loving relationship comes from each of us having a save and non threatening place where we can come to each other and openly express our insecurities and things that may have hurt us.
Today our relationship is stronger and so much more open because of how we have learned to honor each other and make each other first in our lives, right next to Jesus. The pastor that married us (also divorced) taught us so many valuable lessons about not being judgmental or having a tendency to gosip but understanding that people everyday are going through difficult times, and for us to remember that if they do not see Jesus through us they may miss sharing the blessing God has for them, and possibly a deeper relationship with our creator, or a first time relationship with Him.
Now my thoughts about is divorce selfish???? If wanting a marriage that is not presumptuous, but full of love and a reflection of Jesus in place of something that could never be??????????? I don’t wrestle with that question any more and as each circumstance is different each one in that circumstance must answer the question for themself.
thank you for your time.
Hi Karl,
Thank you for sharing your experience. I take it that you disagree with the author I linked to?
You are correct, I do disagree! The statements are too black and white, and believe me I have listened to well meaning misguided people say some of those things, they may have been to me or just in conversation (gossip) to other people about a situation they knew nothing about. To say that someone shot up a school cafeteria because of a divorce is just as insane as the shooting its self. Kids grow up with the influence of a lot of people, then they reach that magical age of adult hood where they make their own decisions, so to blame either a parent or a teacher or even a pastor is absurd. I know some one that is possibly more insure and scarred because the parents stayed together. I do not advocate divorce but I return to my original closing statement. “Each circumstance is different” so you cannot apply such all in composing statements to every situation, that would be like prescribing the same madication for every decease known to man.
Thank you for your response.
Hi Karl,
Would you say your ex-wife was selfish in the divorce?
Hi Joe yes I would say she was selfish, before, during, and after.
From your experience what are your thoughts about the question?
Hi Karl,
Yes, I would say that in nearly every divorce at least one person is being selfish, often it is both. When both people act selflessly, it is difficult for love to not happen.
I’m sorry that your marriage ended in divorce and that people tried to feed you pat answers. I’ve appreciated this discussion. What do you think about what I think?
Hi Joe, yes I agree with you, acting selflessly has allowed our relationship grow each day actually several time a day. I also believe that having a selfless spirit and attitude allows us to be transparent to others and have a non judgmental attitude toward others.
Thank you for your time, I have looked forward to your responses and gave each reply much thought.
Hi Karl,
I have appreciated your interactions and dialogue. I hope that we can spend more time discussing things on this webpage. 🙂
Thank you Joe, I will be watchng your blogs and will come back to you when something tugs at my heart like this one did.
II’LLLLLLL BE BAAK!!!!
I think we are talking about normal people without some sort of psychological disorder here. In a normal situation, perhaps if one person is unselfish and giving, the other person does eventually come around and start to love them in the way that they are being loved.
However a fair portion of the population consists of sociopaths- people who present one image at the start and then start showing their true colors. They take and take because that’s what they like. They don’t care about the other person and never will.
Hi Kay,
Thanks for reading and responding. My understanding is that sociopaths are about 1:4 or 1:5.
What is interesting to me is that some have perfectly normal and happy lives, while others certainly seem to leave a wide swath of destruction in their wake.
Definition of selfish: Lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one’s own personal profit or pleasure.
Definition of selfless: Concerned more with the needs and wishes of others than with one’s own; unselfish.
Karl,
As I read your comments I am trying to understand how these statements you made are unselfish.
“I wanted more from my life and the marriage”
“I for one did not want a business relationship I wanted a Marriage…”
For a divorce not to be selfish, wouldn’t it needs to be selfless (concerned with needs of others). I’m going to throw out my opinion but I think a lot of women have affairs because of unmet emotional needs. Could a women married to a selfless man have unmet needs? Maybe, but enough to cheat? I wouldn’t think so, but I’m no expert. Reading your story Karl, I hear you talking about your unmet needs and frustration with your marriage. I think you got divorced for you, and not for her.
My wife left me in 2010. I’ve been through divorce but I didn’t consent to it. I appealed every way I could but Michigan law gives me no way to stop it. So, ya, I’ve been there. In the years since I have gobbled up everything I can on divorce. Books, radio, trolling the internet, and personally talking to anyone who has been divorced or remarried. I had never been through it, nor had anyone in my family and I needed all the info I could get. It seems like it’s the same story every time. I,I,I,I,I,I,I had to…..(insert victim status or needs for perfect rosy future) because spouse (insert all blame). I honestly can’t think up even a hypothetical reason why a selfless person could selflessly initiate and follow through with a divorce. Someone help, think me up a reason.
For these reasons, I’m going to side with the blogger. Divorce is selfish.